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Thread: Snow and the city Streets

  1. #2601

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    My commuter bike has absolutely hated this brine. Can definitely see a lot more corrosion in the drivetrain

  2. #2602

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    Quote Originally Posted by Titanium48 View Post
    I also think road conditions were better this winter than they have been in previous years, but my standard complaint about the city doing too much dumping of stuff on roads and not enough scraping stuff off of roads still stands.
    I agree with you completely. The city needs to prioritize getting the snow off the streets instead of worrying so much about what to throw onto the snowy streets.

  3. #2603

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    WTF was going on today on East Henday in the morning? Massive backlog with cars in the ditches. There was barely any snow???? Was it that garbage they are spraying on the Henday again. That stuff is extremely dangerous to life and limb it appears or do we just have idiots on the road?

  4. #2604

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    idiots on the road. The Henday is dry.

    The stuff they spray on the Henday is a bit different than what ever mixture the city salts their roads with. The solution works well, when applied at the right time, and in the right conditions, under the right circumstances. The city last year tried to use it as the be-all end-all solution to snow remove/clearing... like anything, you shouldn't place all your eggs in one basket, but that seems like the MO for this city.

  5. #2605
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    Not sure the CC was s[prayed prior to the weekend snow - it has to be laid down before the snow falls.

    I know - and appreciate - folk's concerns. But personally, I love it. And I drive a 14 year old Honda!

    Perhaps the CC needs to be used with more discretion, fine. And maybe if cyclists don't want it on the cycle paths - we should agree to that.

    But on streets and especially hills - hopefully the CoE sticks with the program.
    ... gobsmacked

  6. #2606

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    Quote Originally Posted by happydays View Post
    WTF was going on today on East Henday in the morning? Massive backlog with cars in the ditches. There was barely any snow???? Was it that garbage they are spraying on the Henday again. That stuff is extremely dangerous to life and limb it appears or do we just have idiots on the road?
    What time was this? I was on SouthEast Henday 6:30am and no problem at all on All seasons and very good traction and dry roads. Not one car in the ditch anywhere.


    I suspect we have bad drivers but can't imagine how people went off road into ditches this AM.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  7. #2607

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    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo View Post
    Not sure the CC was s[prayed prior to the weekend snow - it has to be laid down before the snow falls.

    I know - and appreciate - folk's concerns. But personally, I love it. And I drive a 14 year old Honda!

    Perhaps the CC needs to be used with more discretion, fine. And maybe if cyclists don't want it on the cycle paths - we should agree to that.

    But on streets and especially hills - hopefully the CoE sticks with the program.
    I love it too. Really makes for great driving conditions at least 90% of the winter. For sure it could be optional on Cycle and multiuse paths as I do not find it helps walkers/cyclists that much. Does help on road surfaces. I don't worry much about the rust as most vehicles these days seem to be 10yr disposables if that. By the time rust impacts majorly the vehicle is not operating. I don't drive a honda though. Hyundai don't last as long but also cost a lot less.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  8. #2608

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    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo View Post
    Not sure the CC was s[prayed prior to the weekend snow - it has to be laid down before the snow falls.

    I know - and appreciate - folk's concerns. But personally, I love it. And I drive a 14 year old Honda!

    Perhaps the CC needs to be used with more discretion, fine. And maybe if cyclists don't want it on the cycle paths - we should agree to that.

    But on streets and especially hills - hopefully the CoE sticks with the program.
    I found that on bike paths they often sprayed when there was no snow and none in the forecast, so paths would remain wetted for weeks... and then it would snow several inches, enough that whatever brine was left would be just enough so that the snow would stick but not melt rather than blow away.

    I would rather the city work on reasonably prompt snow clearing, and brine/salt ONLY when lanes and paths are icy with sleet like yesterday and today, or with freezing rain.
    There can only be one.

  9. #2609
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    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo View Post
    Not sure the CC was s[prayed prior to the weekend snow - it has to be laid down before the snow falls.

    I know - and appreciate - folk's concerns. But personally, I love it. And I drive a 14 year old Honda!

    Perhaps the CC needs to be used with more discretion, fine. And maybe if cyclists don't want it on the cycle paths - we should agree to that.

    But on streets and especially hills - hopefully the CoE sticks with the program.

    Agree, I am in favour of using de-icer. Much cleaner in the spring and the had far less ice and build up. What do cities such as Ottawa, Montreal and Calgary use and what are their complaints, if any?

  10. #2610
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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    My commuter bike has absolutely hated this brine. Can definitely see a lot more corrosion in the drivetrain
    The grit from the "oatmeal" that formed when the city used sand was just as bad for chewing up bicycle drivetrains. At least the brine makes the ride much more pleasant.

  11. #2611

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    disagree. The sand would muck up the drive train, easily to wash off occasionally. The salt brine needs to wipe your chain and drivetrain after every commute, especially if you have the luxury of storing your bike in a heated garage. I certainly noticed a difference.

  12. #2612
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    Cured concrete will be okay, that woman was on drugs!
    They will have to replace city vehicles sooner, because they aren't washed that often...
    People have every right to be angry...tsk tsk.

  13. #2613
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    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Cured concrete will be okay, that woman was on drugs!
    They will have to replace city vehicles sooner, because they aren't washed that often...
    People have every right to be angry...tsk tsk.
    So wash them more frequently.

  14. #2614

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by McBoo View Post
    Not sure the CC was s[prayed prior to the weekend snow - it has to be laid down before the snow falls.

    I know - and appreciate - folk's concerns. But personally, I love it. And I drive a 14 year old Honda!

    Perhaps the CC needs to be used with more discretion, fine. And maybe if cyclists don't want it on the cycle paths - we should agree to that.

    But on streets and especially hills - hopefully the CoE sticks with the program.
    I love it too. Really makes for great driving conditions at least 90% of the winter. For sure it could be optional on Cycle and multiuse paths as I do not find it helps walkers/cyclists that much. Does help on road surfaces. I don't worry much about the rust as most vehicles these days seem to be 10yr disposables if that. By the time rust impacts majorly the vehicle is not operating. I don't drive a honda though. Hyundai don't last as long but also cost a lot less.
    I found that:
    - sometimes the ice was everywhere last year (no sandy strip beside the ice runs to pull onto to get grip)

    - the spray being kicked up caused longer periods of poorer visibility for me. (More car washes and squeegeeing the windows) Plus more use of windshield washer fluid. So I likely I had more periods of poorer visibility out my side windows too. If this perception was real, then I wonder but am not sure if this would translate city-wide into more net accidents (possibly at higher speeds than simply sliding into rear ends ) but Iíd guess that it would be a possibility.

    If the corrosive effect is worse then this might be affecting a lot more than the vehicles. (Is there an impact on bridges, railings, drainage systems, etc?)

    Also, if vehicles rust faster that severely and negatively impacts the local economy. It might create more repair and replacement (sales) jobs but thatís poor capital allocation since vehicles are an imported good, and any early replacement drains huge amounts of wealth out of the city. If so thatís being penny wise and pound foolish.
    Last edited by KC; 10-10-2018 at 01:54 PM.

  15. #2615

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    If this shortens the average vehicle's life from 13 to 12 years then if there are 500,000 vehicles in the city and each costs an average of 30,000, then there's almost $100m per year drained from the local economy. That's got to be added to the cash outlay to figure out the real cost of our snow clearing system.
    There can only be one.

  16. #2616

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    Quote Originally Posted by Highlander II View Post
    If this shortens the average vehicle's life from 13 to 12 years then if there are 500,000 vehicles in the city and each costs an average of 30,000, then there's almost $100m per year drained from the local economy. That's got to be added to the cash outlay to figure out the real cost of our snow clearing system.
    Wheres the stat that the average vehicle life is 13years? Would also be interested in the mode lifespan. I know so many people that only driver their vehicles for a few years and then get new ones. Seems like so many people do that and that people treat vehicles as disposables. Leases and such also reinforce this. Not to mention that vehicles in general are so poorly engineered that rust is the last think you have to worry about aside from mufflers.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  17. #2617

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    Totally pulled that number from my arse.

    But I have a dying 13-year-old vehicle. Those traded-in 3-4 year old cars all find a new owner.
    There can only be one.

  18. #2618

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    Quote Originally Posted by Highlander II View Post
    Totally pulled that number from my arse.

    But I have a dying 13-year-old vehicle. Those traded-in 3-4 year old cars all find a new owner.
    I live in Millwoods and I rarely see any vehicle on the road that's over a decade old. Like I say I think theres next to no impact in vehicle longevity in actual terms due to anything they put on the roads. Theres also a whole subset of people that would just outright refuse to have a vehicle without the latest bells and whistles. Depreciation also suggests the average vehicle is worth a negligible amount after 10yrs. For most people, what ends up shelving vehicles is when the cost of a massive repair exceeds the vehicle worth. Its planned obsolescence from the industry. Design vehicles that specifically require more than reasonable labor hours to service and that involve overboard on parts that can fail and that are required. Its an industry that exists on people ditching vehicles regularly (which I never do given any other choice but a lemon)
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  19. #2619

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    Found this:

    "The average age of vehicles in Canada has also risen since 2005, according to Polk data. Industry analyst Dennis DesRosiers estimates that the average vehicle hit an age of 8.57 years in 2011."

    I wouldn't doubt that more of the vehicles over 10-12 years old are summer cars or field trucks or otherwise driven less than newer cars but apparently the average car lasts over 15 years. Doesn't say whether this is a mean or a median.
    There can only be one.

  20. #2620
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    Just a FWIW, but I've been driving my GMC Jimmy for 17 of its 21 years and there's only minimal surface rust in the expected spots - rear doorstep and a couple of wheelarches. I get value for money out of my wheels.
    Nisi Dominus Frustra

  21. #2621
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by H.L. View Post
    Cured concrete will be okay, that woman was on drugs!
    They will have to replace city vehicles sooner, because they aren't washed that often...
    People have every right to be angry...tsk tsk.
    So wash them more frequently.
    Yes, that's in everyone's budget..and the city vehicles will come out of yours!

    Incredible..ivory castles?

  22. #2622

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    Quote Originally Posted by Highlander II View Post
    Found this:

    "The average age of vehicles in Canada has also risen since 2005, according to Polk data. Industry analyst Dennis DesRosiers estimates that the average vehicle hit an age of 8.57 years in 2011."

    I wouldn't doubt that more of the vehicles over 10-12 years old are summer cars or field trucks or otherwise driven less than newer cars but apparently the average car lasts over 15 years. Doesn't say whether this is a mean or a median.
    Since we've had this convo I've looked at some of the research. Seems to be a range of information, very brand and model specific, and of concern to me is this is industry cited data. I don't see a lot in terms of fully independent study. Of course manufacturers will want to fudge data any way they can to make it look like their product lasts longer. I tend to believe very little that comes out of the auto industry in terms of track record.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

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