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Thread: Around the NHL

  1. #3001

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    No top picked player performs well in NHL bottomsix. It doesn't happen.
    I think you if you look at bottom six forwards, many of the best of them were top draft picks. Ovechkin did pretty well in the bottom six. NHL isn't an easy league. Yak is a good player against low quality goalies / defense - he can put up the points then - but he never learned a team game - he has had the best coaches and trainers in the world over the last few years trying to teach that to him - it hasn't worked and it won't work. Sometimes a bust happens - and its never because a player got ruined by a team, its because a player simply didn't have what it takes, either in effort or aptitude.

  2. #3002
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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    No top picked player performs well in NHL bottomsix. It doesn't happen.
    I think you if you look at bottom six forwards, many of the best of them were top draft picks. Ovechkin did pretty well in the bottom six. NHL isn't an easy league. Yak is a good player against low quality goalies / defense - he can put up the points then - but he never learned a team game - he has had the best coaches and trainers in the world over the last few years trying to teach that to him - it hasn't worked and it won't work. Sometimes a bust happens - and its never because a player got ruined by a team, its because a player simply didn't have what it takes, either in effort or aptitude.
    a la Jason Bonsignore...

  3. #3003

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    The moment I saw the Ducks score against us in the playoffs because Eberle coughed up the puck twice on the same shift to avoid taking a hit, I knew he wasn't a guy that should be on this team.

  4. #3004

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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    No top picked player performs well in NHL bottomsix. It doesn't happen.
    I think you if you look at bottom six forwards, many of the best of them were top draft picks. Ovechkin did pretty well in the bottom six. NHL isn't an easy league. Yak is a good player against low quality goalies / defense - he can put up the points then - but he never learned a team game - he has had the best coaches and trainers in the world over the last few years trying to teach that to him - it hasn't worked and it won't work. Sometimes a bust happens - and its never because a player got ruined by a team, its because a player simply didn't have what it takes, either in effort or aptitude.
    "Its never because a good player got ruined by a team"

    That's your opinion. Certainly mismanagement, and gross mismanagement of players occurs. It often enough separates the incompetent orgs from the others.

    I have a question for you. What Edmonton Oiler improved, developed, during Eakins 2 season reign of incompetent terror? Imagine being a rookie in that milieu.
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  5. #3005

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    The moment I saw the Ducks score against us in the playoffs because Eberle coughed up the puck twice on the same shift to avoid taking a hit, I knew he wasn't a guy that should be on this team.
    Him being a passenger in the playoffs was his death sentence. Chia and the team can be saying other things, because they are wiser than Lowe and McT at not making public their real thoughts, but Eberle was a passenger, in the playoffs. He wasn't even involved out there. No sense of increased intensity, being difficult to play against, or being a challenge to contain. He was a ghost. The only remaining hope with Eberle is that some thought he would be able to elevate in the playoffs.

    Eberle has never responded well to close checking, never, so I'm not sure how anybody felt he would excel in the playoffs.
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  6. #3006

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    ^^I don't think Eakins was a good NHL coach, but he has had quite a bit of success with Junior teams and AHL teams (he is coach of the San Deigo Gulls, who reached playoffs in first two seasons of existance), so to claim he "ruins" players, is quite a stretch. Taylor Hall, Nuge and Eberle didn't all suddenly suck because of Eakins.

  7. #3007

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    Every one of them except Hall declined. As I mentioned Schultz and Gagner nearly had their careers destroyed by Eakins. Nuge and Eberles contribution and production fell under Eakins. Hall was good enough to survive Eakins and had already established his NHL career.

    I stated earlier that if a team believes in you it goes a long way. Not sure if you looked at that post. Its key.

    Just as a side example, not of incompetence, but mismanagement lets look at Yzerman vs Drouin. Yzerman a bright guy normally for some reason buries Drouin in the AHL, hardballs him in negotiation, questions his commitment and level of play and responsibility, and generally makes a case againt him while playing a lot of other lesser players. It gets to the point where Drouin and his agent start requesting a trade. Yzerman then pulls Drouin up into the NHL lineup and voila Drouin was one of the most productive and electric Lightning players since. They guy reeks of talent, he's the most talented forward they had next to Kucherov, and Stamkos. Now he's gone, and traded for meager return as the bad blood never went away and now Drouin gets to play in Montreal, probably his first choice anyway.

    Drouin wins this hands down, the whole player file was botched incredibly by Yzerman who misjudged the player and his agent and created this discord. So now Yzerman is left with a non playoff club minus one of his best forwards. Montreal gets a returning son that is sure to be a big player for the Habs and a fan favorite.

    Even bright guys mismanage players. Its hard to understand why or how it occurs. But this would be a case illustration of what not to do with any player. I'll add that Yzerman and Cooper are a little smarmy and play faves in Tampa. These are solid guys with solid careers but they have certain slants, for, and against some players. Drouin was never one they were batting for for whatever reasons.
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  8. #3008

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    ^Drouin had roughly the same stats as Eberle last season (and a contract almost as expensive at 5.5m), but now we see he is one of your favorites too, supposedly driven out of town, but I guess Eberle is not a "ruined player" like your superstar Yakupov? I wouldn't pay that for Drouin, and I'm glad Eberle is moved on for a reasonable return.
    Last edited by moahunter; 27-06-2017 at 11:59 AM.

  9. #3009

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    Drouin had 53 points in 73GP

    Eberle had 53 pts in 95GP

    Works out to Drouin .726ppg

    Eberle .557ppg


    A per usual your degree of analysis is way off. The two above production levels are dissimilar if one looks even at the actual GP stats.


    Also, nearly every one of Drouins goals is hilite worthy. He's an absolutely electric player making plays that get fans out of their seats. he's a pleasure to watch. He's also young and improving.

    Frankly I can't remember the last time Eberle scored a hilite reel goal.

    Drouin doesn't impress you? Sometimes I think you don't even watch hockey. The guy is a potential allstar.
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    Anyone else get frustrated when former players without any real management experience get thrust into high-powered roles?

    The benefit, obviously, could be in leveraging the experience of the former player. The risk is experiencing lack of performance / competency in areas of little real world management. I'm not up on the details of the Yzerman / Drouin saga, and I don't really care all that much, but as an Oiler fan I think we have experienced this far too much over the years.

    The best decision is to hold accountable the person who is ultimately responsible for a failure, regardless of how painful it may be. In this case, Yzerman perhaps should have been taken aside by someone in the organization to inject a dose of reality and responsibility. If the strategy in dealing with a player fails, another strategy is required. If one cannot be found... Bring in another solution (i.e. someone else).

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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetcrude View Post
    ...
    The best decision is to hold accountable the person who is ultimately responsible for a failure, regardless of how painful it may be. ...
    Boy, did you ever get it right.

    One of the fundamental problems for the Oilers during the ditch and draft decade was the utter lack of accountability for some of the worst team management in the history of the game. It was bound to trickle down to the players.

    They clearly either didn't want to win, had no clue how to win, or, most likely, both. When failure gets rewarded, and success punished, it shouldn't be surprising when teams fail. It's so much easier than trying to win.
    aka Jim Good; "The sooner you fall behind, the more time you have to catch up." - Steven Wright

  12. #3012

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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetcrude View Post
    Anyone else get frustrated when former players without any real management experience get thrust into high-powered roles?

    The benefit, obviously, could be in leveraging the experience of the former player. The risk is experiencing lack of performance / competency in areas of little real world management. I'm not up on the details of the Yzerman / Drouin saga, and I don't really care all that much, but as an Oiler fan I think we have experienced this far too much over the years.

    The best decision is to hold accountable the person who is ultimately responsible for a failure, regardless of how painful it may be. In this case, Yzerman perhaps should have been taken aside by someone in the organization to inject a dose of reality and responsibility. If the strategy in dealing with a player fails, another strategy is required. If one cannot be found... Bring in another solution (i.e. someone else).
    With regards to the Yzerman Drouin situation Yzerman really got on this kid specifically for some reason. At one point even a quote about him needing to be more responsible with the puck (he was a rookie) and it seemed like Yzerman was holding the kid up to his own rookie level performance. It was strange. Sometimes two personalities just conflict. No love lost all round. Which is odd. I give it one season and Drouin will be one of the more popular Habs.

    I used this example though as even competent people have instances that they entirely mismanage. Its one reason why the Pro sports sense of a head GM, and a head coach, that call a lot of the shots, can fail. I think you need a wider group, and as you say people that will hand off. Not everybody deals with everybody well. Most orgs, most businesses acknowledge this. If a relationship isn't working hand off to somebody else.

    Also, as I mention Drouin was easily the 3rd best Lightning forward. He's worth Millions. Yzerman effectively screwed the team out of that worth. What is Yzerman worth as a manager? He's manager of a team that barely made the playoffs two seasons ago, just squeezing in, and missed last year. Lombardi got fired in LA for the same and he had a club that won two SC's.
    Last edited by Replacement; 27-06-2017 at 08:55 PM.
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  13. #3013
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    Sam Gagner signs with Vancouver, and with Kassian here in Edmonton the irony of this is all too awesome!
    Benoit Pouliot signs a 1 yr deal with Buffalo.
    Pitlick signs 3 year with Dallas.
    Oesterle is apparently signing with Chicago.
    Last edited by Sonic Death Monkey; 01-07-2017 at 10:28 AM.
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  14. #3014

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    ^Columbus is such a stacked lineup, and with a lot of good young players needing toi, that I don't know that even Tortorella could continue to use Gagner in the same way. It was refreshing actually seeing a coach help a player resurrect and utilize him properly and Torts for the most part did that. Although Gagner had limited toi at 13-14mins he had a constant PP gig. But did well in bottomsix as well.

    Nucks get a player that had 50pts last season and that works hard to stay competitive, works really hard in the offseason, has a complete gym in his home and he works out countless hours every day, and really has to work hard as a small player to stay relevant in the league. Gagner has matured into a quintessential pro. A player that recognizes the need to do everything, every day in his life, to have any edge. I actually think Gagner, who has been made to go through this ringer where he HAS to resurrect and prove himself is somewhat better for it and probably a better player than Eberle or RNH at this point, neither of whom would have 50pts had they been playing appreciable bottomsix minutes, neither of whom have continued to work as hard on their respective games.

    I feel sorry, almost, for Buffalo.

    Best wishes for Pitlick, and only repeated injuries kept him out here. He showed enough to at least rotate into the lineup. Hope he can stay healthy. Enjoyed watching him give it all here. If you could cross the drive and perseverance of Pitlick, with the gifts and health or Pouliot you would have quite a player. alas
    Last edited by Replacement; 01-07-2017 at 11:53 AM.
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  16. #3016
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    It doesn't mention if it's one or two way, but I would assume one way. Even if he falls on his face and they bury him, his salary is low enough that it wouldn't count against the cap while in the AHL.

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    Tyler Wong scores first Las Vegas Goal:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-_Z_LvvYwE

    Update: Tyler Wong has a hat trick.
    Last edited by The_Cat; 17-09-2017 at 05:24 PM.
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  18. #3018

    Default NHL doctor to examine Lupul

    Am I understanding this right? Lupul is basically claiming that the Leafs are intentionally keeping him in IR, by falsifying the medical test:

    http://www.tsn.ca/nhl-to-have-indepe...lupul-1.863244

    Lupul posted a photo on Instagram on Sunday of what appeared to be him snowboarding, with the comments, "Haha failed physical? They cheat, everyone lets them," and "I'm ready.. Just awaiting the call." The post, which has since been deleted, came three days after Leafs GM Lou Lamoriello said the Fort Saskatchewan, Alta., product had failed his medical on the first day of Leafs' training camp.

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    Yup, that's what he's saying. They're basically trying to bury his contract on IR, freeing up money for another player (at least that's the allegation).
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  20. #3020
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    What an dummy. He should have kept his mouth shut. If he's found to be healthy, he's going to either get buried in the minors riding the bus, or retroactively bought out. One costs his lifestyle (he's getting paid full salary to sit on his tush, or travel the world, whatever he wants), the other would cost him I believe 1/3 of his salary.

    What's more interesting to me is what the consequences for the Leafs will be if they are found to have falsified or influenced his medical. Because of the cap, the NHL needs to make sure that things are on the up and up with players on the IR should genuinely be there, and are not just a way of getting a bad contract off the books.

  21. #3021

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    Anybody watch the game in China between the Kings vs Canucks? I'm missing these due to the odd start times. Interesting to have some games there and see what kind of interest there is. At least they picked west coast clubs due to the travel length.

    Canucks look like speed bumps again this season.
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  22. #3022

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    What an dummy. He should have kept his mouth shut. If he's found to be healthy, he's going to either get buried in the minors riding the bus, or retroactively bought out. One costs his lifestyle (he's getting paid full salary to sit on his tush, or travel the world, whatever he wants), the other would cost him I believe 1/3 of his salary.

    What's more interesting to me is what the consequences for the Leafs will be if they are found to have falsified or influenced his medical. Because of the cap, the NHL needs to make sure that things are on the up and up with players on the IR should genuinely be there, and are not just a way of getting a bad contract off the books.
    Lupul is from a wealthy Edmonton family - money isn't a concern to him, so you need to keep in mind that context. I guess he just wants to play in NHL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    What an dummy. He should have kept his mouth shut. If he's found to be healthy, he's going to either get buried in the minors riding the bus, or retroactively bought out. One costs his lifestyle (he's getting paid full salary to sit on his tush, or travel the world, whatever he wants), the other would cost him I believe 1/3 of his salary.

    What's more interesting to me is what the consequences for the Leafs will be if they are found to have falsified or influenced his medical. Because of the cap, the NHL needs to make sure that things are on the up and up with players on the IR should genuinely be there, and are not just a way of getting a bad contract off the books.
    Lupul is from a wealthy Edmonton family - money isn't a concern to him, so you need to keep in mind that context. I guess he just wants to play in NHL.
    He is? Kind of like the Rockefellers of Ft.Saskatchewan eh?

  24. #3024

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    Quote Originally Posted by maclac View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    What an dummy. He should have kept his mouth shut. If he's found to be healthy, he's going to either get buried in the minors riding the bus, or retroactively bought out. One costs his lifestyle (he's getting paid full salary to sit on his tush, or travel the world, whatever he wants), the other would cost him I believe 1/3 of his salary.

    What's more interesting to me is what the consequences for the Leafs will be if they are found to have falsified or influenced his medical. Because of the cap, the NHL needs to make sure that things are on the up and up with players on the IR should genuinely be there, and are not just a way of getting a bad contract off the books.
    Lupul is from a wealthy Edmonton family - money isn't a concern to him, so you need to keep in mind that context. I guess he just wants to play in NHL.
    He is? Kind of like the Rockefellers of Ft.Saskatchewan eh?
    Yep. He hails from Fort Saskatchewan. From a fairly normal, albeit professional family.

    The reality is most NHL players come from some degree of wealth. Its hard to play the sport to the level they do without appreciable financial advantage as the sport, travel, training is expensive. In this way Lupul is not unlike say 80% of NHL players. Its no longer a working class pro game.
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  25. #3025
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    It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out, for the team, and for him. I hope it turns out the Leafs really were trying to bury him just to see what the league does about it. It'll give the sports commentators in Toronto something to talk about
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  26. #3026

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    Lupul is kind of an ongoing interesting casestudy. He tends to burn bridges any team he plays for. Without going into too much detail he's a speak first, think last kind of person. Taylor Hall was a bit like that as well but could back it up on the ice and was worth the squeeze for what he could do out there. Joffrey Lupul is annoying, and largely ineffectual as an NHL player. Then with huge chronic injury question marks.

    Lupul is the kind of player you get rid of when you get better as a club.
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  27. #3027
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    Which makes the "bury his contact on IR" scenario seem plausible.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  28. #3028
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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    What an dummy. He should have kept his mouth shut. If he's found to be healthy, he's going to either get buried in the minors riding the bus, or retroactively bought out. One costs his lifestyle (he's getting paid full salary to sit on his tush, or travel the world, whatever he wants), the other would cost him I believe 1/3 of his salary.

    What's more interesting to me is what the consequences for the Leafs will be if they are found to have falsified or influenced his medical. Because of the cap, the NHL needs to make sure that things are on the up and up with players on the IR should genuinely be there, and are not just a way of getting a bad contract off the books.
    Lupul is from a wealthy Edmonton family - money isn't a concern to him, so you need to keep in mind that context. I guess he just wants to play in NHL.
    I'm aware, my uncle was his first agent out of junior. Regardless, it's idiotic to potentially lose roughly 1.5 million dollars or spend 8 months riding the bus in the AHL because you couldn't keep your trap shut on Instagram.

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    So Jagr is signing a 1 year deal with the Godless Flames. Should be interesting.
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  30. #3030

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    AS I stated earlier I wouldn't want an ineffective +40yr old Jagr on my team. I haven't been that keen on his overall play in recent years.

    Kind of smacks of desperation down south that this is what they need to sign.

    I used to like Jagr's play, who wouldn't, but the present day Jagr is just engaging in nostalgia.

    He didn't help the Panthers much last season and he won't help the Flames considerably.
    Last edited by Replacement; 02-10-2017 at 11:19 AM.
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    That's interesting.

    Top_Dawg thought he just recently signed to play with some European team.

    How does he get out of that contract ?

  32. #3032
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    I think he owned that team, so it's not a problem for him to get out of the contract.

    So what you're saying is I should drive down to Calgary and offload all my Jagr rookie cards before the season starts?
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  33. #3033

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    Maybe the flames are rating him based on this article, that surprisingly, puts him at #7 for NHL RW's?

    http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/d...three-seasons/

    Doubt the old man at your peril, because at 44 years old last year Jagr was still on the edge of being elite. The knock on him is that he’s slow, which is true, but that lack of speed doesn’t seem to hinder him because his hockey sense is nearly unparalleled.

    Jagr remains one of the best generators of on-ice goals at even strength in the NHL, transitions the puck more effectively than almost any winger in the game, and dumps the puck less than any other right-winger. Jagr’s ability to protect the puck and complete a smart play makes his linemates better, and he was almost the sole reason the Panthers weren’t completely in the tank while most of their star players suffered injuries last year. He’s incredible, and some team needs to sign him right now.
    Last edited by moahunter; 02-10-2017 at 02:43 PM.

  34. #3034

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    Present day Jagr will seem to do a lot, and create a lot of scoring chances. But the finish is declined substantially, as has the speed, and a lot of what you see with Jagr is some good Corsi, SOG, and not much else.

    Gets a lot of shifts, lots of topsix, PP, and not that much to show for it. Worse you have him in your lineup instead of developing a player that may be of future use. Why? Nostalgia, no other reason.

    Actually a team like the Canucks picking up a player like Gagner, who can still drive some offense, is a very quiet, but better signing, than present day Jagr who has a huge name and is past his prime. Its hilarious that its the Flames doing this pickup. What does Jagr have left to play for? This is not someone who helps you make the playoffs or be a contending club.

    Tyler Dellow, lol. Bookend to Eakins failure of advanced stats and approach in Edmonton. Bad memories. But lets rate more players on that basis..

    lol further that eberle is on the list. My lord. Theres few easier topsix wingers to play against in the league the last couple years.
    Last edited by Replacement; 02-10-2017 at 03:03 PM.
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  35. #3035

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    It would be interesting if we signed Ignila now. I remember watching a documentary years ago, about how he always came to pre-season stronger and fitter than anyone else. While his best is long gone, he is still quite an inspiring guy, and would be a nice home coming re his St Albert childhood. Probably doesn't make sense though, to keep a spot from a player we need to develop.

  36. #3036

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    So now a team losing a challenge regarding offside on goals scored will be penalized 2 mins for delay of game.

    I don't like this. Its another level of abstraction that takes away from the game on the ice. So now not only can a team get jobbed on a bad call and review. They also get a penalty if they lose the challenge on it. That's a standard double consequence, something to be avoided.

    Every time the NHL does something like this it takes away from the players on the ice deciding outcomes. I don't think any fan really wants these kinds of changes. Theres enough arbitrary calls and influence of outcomes already.
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  37. #3037
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    Eichel signed for 10mil a season? That seems a bit rich, but I guess he's young and with a full season and growth maybe he's a 30goal scorer?

  38. #3038

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    ^he seems to be a prick, but there was talk not so long ago of him challenging CMD, so 10m is probably ok.

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    10 yrs in buffalo seems like a long time unless they make strong moves to be competitive again. I think that was one of his biggest gripes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    So now a team losing a challenge regarding offside on goals scored will be penalized 2 mins for delay of game.

    I don't like this. Its another level of abstraction that takes away from the game on the ice. So now not only can a team get jobbed on a bad call and review. They also get a penalty if they lose the challenge on it. That's a standard double consequence, something to be avoided.

    Every time the NHL does something like this it takes away from the players on the ice deciding outcomes. I don't think any fan really wants these kinds of changes. Theres enough arbitrary calls and influence of outcomes already.
    Respectfully disagree.

    The challenge should be used when the call made is truly being challenged. If there is such certainty that a call has been missed in an egregious manner, then there should be no concern whatsoever about making a challenge. However, in truth, teams use it for purposes other than to reverse a call which should be penalized (e.g. to slow down a game or manage the crowd's involvement) if this is the case.

  41. #3041

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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetcrude View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    So now a team losing a challenge regarding offside on goals scored will be penalized 2 mins for delay of game.

    I don't like this. Its another level of abstraction that takes away from the game on the ice. So now not only can a team get jobbed on a bad call and review. They also get a penalty if they lose the challenge on it. That's a standard double consequence, something to be avoided.

    Every time the NHL does something like this it takes away from the players on the ice deciding outcomes. I don't think any fan really wants these kinds of changes. Theres enough arbitrary calls and influence of outcomes already.
    Respectfully disagree.

    The challenge should be used when the call made is truly being challenged. If there is such certainty that a call has been missed in an egregious manner, then there should be no concern whatsoever about making a challenge. However, in truth, teams use it for purposes other than to reverse a call which should be penalized (e.g. to slow down a game or manage the crowd's involvement) if this is the case.
    Fair comment, thanks for the response. Given that its offside contention it stands to reason that calls that were obvious would either be called right away or in a review. So that only the really close examples are missed. Still it sets up a dichotomy where in some close calls the goal stands and the penalty is assessed (double consequence) while in others the goal is waived off and no penalty. A lot of these circumstances will look identical and wherein the rulings could go either way. That's the arbitrary part of it.

    But your point is solid.
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    At least the refs have the large iPads this season, so they should have a better view of whether the offside call is right or not. I wonder how much it'd cost to install high speed cameras (120 fps) along the bluelines in each rink? That's one of the issues with the current setup - at 30 FPS, the cameras aren't capturing enough information for the speeds players and pucks are traveling at.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gord Lacey View Post
    At least the refs have the large iPads this season, so they should have a better view of whether the offside call is right or not. I wonder how much it'd cost to install high speed cameras (120 fps) along the bluelines in each rink? That's one of the issues with the current setup - at 30 FPS, the cameras aren't capturing enough information for the speeds players and pucks are traveling at.
    I've wondered this for years. As long as Tennis has adopted all the line sensors which offer near perfect results.

    The trouble is in hockey its not just an object in play to scan its the skate of other players. Albeit sensors could be put in every puck and skate.

    Is the current setup 30fps? That would suffice well for standard broadcast but not so much for frame by frame replay examination.

    But lastly if 30 vs 120fps is required to differentiate I would counter that plays that are that close could just be considered onside.
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    Postmedia sports writers have to be about the worst. Completely clueless. 5/9 polled recently picked the Dallas Stars to make the SC final and advance out of the West. Dallas missed the playoffs last year and can't play D to save their lives. Dallas, imo predictably, loses their first 2 games including to the Expansion Las Vegas Golden nights and are already 0-2. Giving up countless scoring chances.

    Meanwhile the same wags have Tampa, who also missed the playoffs advancing in the East and winning the cup. Most of them are apparently huge tampa fans. Tampa also missed the playoffs last year.

    Yeah I know Stamkos is back. But Drouin, one of the best players for the Lightning last season, is gone.

    Meanwhile another media darling, the Winnipeg Jets, who always seem to be pumped by TSN are again pathetic and have been blown out in both of their games this season allowing 13GA in 2GP thus far. The Jets are absolutely hopeless. How anybody could pick this club to make the playoffs I have no idea. They were up 3-1 against the Flames and lost going away, 6-3. Teams should start spotting the Jets a two goal lead.
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  45. #3045

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Postmedia sports writers have to be about the worst. Completely clueless. 5/9 polled recently picked the Dallas Stars to make the SC final and advance out of the West. Dallas missed the playoffs last year and can't play D to save their lives. Dallas, imo predictably, loses their first 2 games including to the Expansion Las Vegas Golden nights and are already 0-2. Giving up countless scoring chances.

    Meanwhile the same wags have Tampa, who also missed the playoffs advancing in the East and winning the cup. Most of them are apparently huge tampa fans. Tampa also missed the playoffs last year.

    Yeah I know Stamkos is back. But Drouin, one of the best players for the Lightning last season, is gone.

    Meanwhile another media darling, the Winnipeg Jets, who always seem to be pumped by TSN are again pathetic and have been blown out in both of their games this season allowing 13GA in 2GP thus far. The Jets are absolutely hopeless. How anybody could pick this club to make the playoffs I have no idea. They were up 3-1 against the Flames and lost going away, 6-3. Teams should start spotting the Jets a two goal lead.
    Looks like the Oilers listened... unfortunately!

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    Haha, good catch. Looks like the Oilers did. Although they were outshooting the Jets 16-7 at the point the Jets took a 2-0 lead against the grain of play.

    Oh well, its a long season, not much of what happens in the Fall really matters much in the NHL. Oilers will get on track.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Haha, good catch. Looks like the Oilers did. Although they were outshooting the Jets 16-7 at the point the Jets took a 2-0 lead against the grain of play.

    Oh well, its a long season, not much of what happens in the Fall really matters much in the NHL. Oilers will get on track.
    It is a long season, and there will be some good stretches and some bad ones. Hopefully the bad ones are short and the good ones long. But, man, it's great to put points up on the board now, because it's harder later.

    Winnipeg isn't as lousy as you seem to believe. Their goaltending has been atrocious, but their defence is better than you think if they can stay healthy.

    Josh Morrissey was obviously overshadowed by Laine as a rookie last year, but he was a revelation, playing first pairing minutes out of the chute due to injuries and contract holdouts. Getting Kulikov was a very good move. Trouba had a slow start due to contract negotiations, and he's very good. Tyler Myers was injured for all but 11 games last season, and he's good.

    So they've effectively added Myers and Kulikov to last year's squad, and Morrissey has a year under his belt. Enstrom is a veteran 3rd pairing guy, and, of course, Dustin Bufulglien is still a presence, if no longer a force.

    Not too bad.

    They have some really good forwards. The Scheifle-Wheeler-Ehlers line should be very good this year. Brian Little is getting on, but he's been one of the most under-rated players in the league for years. Of course Laine.

    Not a lot of depth.

    Now if only their goalie coach can show them how to get in the way of pucks, instead of out of the way like they have been, and they should make a run for a spot this year. Good goaltending is 50% of the game, until you don't have it, then it's 100% of the game.

    I've never been much of a Paul Maurice fan.
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    I wonder if Vegas is going to surprise this year. Maybe it's just lady luck on their side. But if Fleury plays wall, I guess there's a chance they could be at least in the mix for a spot. They're probably better than Arizona and Van.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Haha, good catch. Looks like the Oilers did. Although they were outshooting the Jets 16-7 at the point the Jets took a 2-0 lead against the grain of play.

    Oh well, its a long season, not much of what happens in the Fall really matters much in the NHL. Oilers will get on track.
    Your guy Kopitar is looking good this season. So is Quick. And Doughty. LA could really sneak up on some people.
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    Still very early, things are all over the map across the league. Dustin Brown isn't a point a game player again, that's for sure.

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    ^Yak won't keep shooting at 27% as well (I remember same thing happened early in his Oilers career)...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Still very early, things are all over the map across the league. Dustin Brown isn't a point a game player again, that's for sure.
    I think Colorado won their first six games last season, and finished with one of the worst records ever.

    Terry Jones says he thinks players were reading their press clippings after the Calgary game (which was hardly a blowout), and thought it was going to be easier. I think so too.

    It's early, but it's never too early to panic
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    Every season there's half a dozen teams that come flying out of the gates and then fade after the first month, and vice versa, a handful of teams that stumble out of the gate and then come on strong in the back three quarters of the season. Was it last year that Anaheim had that brutal start? That horrible start took them to the semi-finals. So it still remains the case that no one really expects Detroit Vegas to make the playoffs. But yeah, the Oilers better get their crap together soon.

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    I don't know about shot counter at Rogers. I know the Oilers had a lot of shots, but no way that was a 51 shot game.

    Like the game a few nights ago, when Oilers shots went from 7 to 11 - between periods.

    I gotta think this turns around soon. Need some timely saves, obviously. Sekera badly missed, as is Draisaitl. If there's a silver lining for Draisaitl, it's that there was so much time between games.
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    ^ I haven't been following the team this year for obvious reasons.

    I was at work when (mercifully) the game was on. Is Draisaitl back?
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    Quote Originally Posted by envaneo View Post
    ^ I haven't been following the team this year for obvious reasons.

    I was at work when (mercifully) the game was on. Is Draisaitl back?
    Not back yet. And I posted Oilers stuff in the wrong thread. Again
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Haha, good catch. Looks like the Oilers did. Although they were outshooting the Jets 16-7 at the point the Jets took a 2-0 lead against the grain of play.

    Oh well, its a long season, not much of what happens in the Fall really matters much in the NHL. Oilers will get on track.
    Your guy Kopitar is looking good this season. So is Quick. And Doughty. LA could really sneak up on some people.
    Brown is again looking like being worth it. The team looks rejuvenated with a new coach. Muzzin also back up to where he should be and some of the system players they have brought up in recent years are now paying dividends. Kings are a decent org and show kids how to play the game the right way and not cheat. They play system hockey and responsibility throughout system. Not loading up on pts in the AHL.

    With the Kings you get the best contributions of the vet players when they feel that the club legitimately has a chance. Kopitar and others were guilty last year of not having as much hope with Quick being injured longterm in the first game of the season. As stated at the time few clubs would survive that. Maybe only the Penguins.

    All that said LA has had an easy schedule thus far. They are still short a couple players as I see it. Man Williams would look good back on that club.
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    Dustin Brown was a monster in a couple games I've semi-watched so far. Maybe he was just too beat up last year. I don't know how much he has left in that banged up body.

    I still think Quick is one of the best in the league, and when the team plays that (boring) smothering style it can be a challenge to even get a decent scoring chance. When a team does, Quick shuts the door.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Postmedia sports writers have to be about the worst. Completely clueless. 5/9 polled recently picked the Dallas Stars to make the SC final and advance out of the West. Dallas missed the playoffs last year and can't play D to save their lives. Dallas, imo predictably, loses their first 2 games including to the Expansion Las Vegas Golden nights and are already 0-2. Giving up countless scoring chances.

    Meanwhile the same wags have Tampa, who also missed the playoffs advancing in the East and winning the cup. Most of them are apparently huge tampa fans. Tampa also missed the playoffs last year.

    Yeah I know Stamkos is back. But Drouin, one of the best players for the Lightning last season, is gone.

    Meanwhile another media darling, the Winnipeg Jets, who always seem to be pumped by TSN are again pathetic and have been blown out in both of their games this season allowing 13GA in 2GP thus far. The Jets are absolutely hopeless. How anybody could pick this club to make the playoffs I have no idea. They were up 3-1 against the Flames and lost going away, 6-3. Teams should start spotting the Jets a two goal lead.
    I know you have a hate on for Yzerman and Tampa, but they're lighting it up right now.

    Yesterday they had the leading point getter, leading goal scorer, leading assist getter, leading save %, and leading wins for a goalie.

    Yzerman sure did screw with Drouin, and I don't know why. But he fleeced the Habs out of Sergachev (the guy the Oilers should have taken in the draft - but they can't help themselves, and go for the shiny toy).

    Bergevin is the worst GM in the league right now. Yzerman dealing from a position of weakness, and still gets the #1 D prospect in the league out of Bergevin, an absolute stud who has 4 goals in limited ice time, because Bergevin wants a French guy.
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  60. #3060

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Postmedia sports writers have to be about the worst. Completely clueless. 5/9 polled recently picked the Dallas Stars to make the SC final and advance out of the West. Dallas missed the playoffs last year and can't play D to save their lives. Dallas, imo predictably, loses their first 2 games including to the Expansion Las Vegas Golden nights and are already 0-2. Giving up countless scoring chances.

    Meanwhile the same wags have Tampa, who also missed the playoffs advancing in the East and winning the cup. Most of them are apparently huge tampa fans. Tampa also missed the playoffs last year.

    Yeah I know Stamkos is back. But Drouin, one of the best players for the Lightning last season, is gone.

    Meanwhile another media darling, the Winnipeg Jets, who always seem to be pumped by TSN are again pathetic and have been blown out in both of their games this season allowing 13GA in 2GP thus far. The Jets are absolutely hopeless. How anybody could pick this club to make the playoffs I have no idea. They were up 3-1 against the Flames and lost going away, 6-3. Teams should start spotting the Jets a two goal lead.
    I know you have a hate on for Yzerman and Tampa, but they're lighting it up right now.

    Yesterday they had the leading point getter, leading goal scorer, leading assist getter, leading save %, and leading wins for a goalie.

    Yzerman sure did screw with Drouin, and I don't know why. But he fleeced the Habs out of Sergachev (the guy the Oilers should have taken in the draft - but they can't help themselves, and go for the shiny toy).

    Bergevin is the worst GM in the league right now. Yzerman dealing from a position of weakness, and still gets the #1 D prospect in the league out of Bergevin, an absolute stud who has 4 goals in limited ice time, because Bergevin wants a French guy.
    Yeah, Tampa is knocking it out of the park. You have to think more behind the scenes stuff was going on with Drouin aside from the contractual squabble. Yzerman isn't dumb, but I think he's kind of stubborn like Lowe. In anycase some guys you identify with as a coach or GM and some you don't. Cooper prefers his guys that he coached in AHL.

    Hey, Kempe scored his 5th goal for the Kings tonight in only his 9th game. Every goal he's scored has been nice. Kings just have way better scouting than we do to find gems like this. Kid has everything. Speed, hands, verve, creativity. This kid could be a star.

    AS far as Montreal they are really screwed up. The Subban deal really backfired and I think was the start of that team no longer contending. No knock on Weber. just that Subban younger, and had more left to give. So many good players the Habs have parted with.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Postmedia sports writers have to be about the worst. Completely clueless. 5/9 polled recently picked the Dallas Stars to make the SC final and advance out of the West. Dallas missed the playoffs last year and can't play D to save their lives. Dallas, imo predictably, loses their first 2 games including to the Expansion Las Vegas Golden nights and are already 0-2. Giving up countless scoring chances.

    Meanwhile the same wags have Tampa, who also missed the playoffs advancing in the East and winning the cup. Most of them are apparently huge tampa fans. Tampa also missed the playoffs last year.

    Yeah I know Stamkos is back. But Drouin, one of the best players for the Lightning last season, is gone.

    Meanwhile another media darling, the Winnipeg Jets, who always seem to be pumped by TSN are again pathetic and have been blown out in both of their games this season allowing 13GA in 2GP thus far. The Jets are absolutely hopeless. How anybody could pick this club to make the playoffs I have no idea. They were up 3-1 against the Flames and lost going away, 6-3. Teams should start spotting the Jets a two goal lead.
    I know you have a hate on for Yzerman and Tampa, but they're lighting it up right now.

    Yesterday they had the leading point getter, leading goal scorer, leading assist getter, leading save %, and leading wins for a goalie.

    Yzerman sure did screw with Drouin, and I don't know why. But he fleeced the Habs out of Sergachev (the guy the Oilers should have taken in the draft - but they can't help themselves, and go for the shiny toy).

    Bergevin is the worst GM in the league right now. Yzerman dealing from a position of weakness, and still gets the #1 D prospect in the league out of Bergevin, an absolute stud who has 4 goals in limited ice time, because Bergevin wants a French guy.
    Yeah, Tampa is knocking it out of the park. You have to think more behind the scenes stuff was going on with Drouin aside from the contractual squabble. Yzerman isn't dumb, but I think he's kind of stubborn like Lowe. In anycase some guys you identify with as a coach or GM and some you don't. Cooper prefers his guys that he coached in AHL.

    Hey, Kempe scored his 5th goal for the Kings tonight in only his 9th game. Every goal he's scored has been nice. Kings just have way better scouting than we do to find gems like this. Kid has everything. Speed, hands, verve, creativity. This kid could be a star.

    AS far as Montreal they are really screwed up. The Subban deal really backfired and I think was the start of that team no longer contending. No knock on Weber. just that Subban younger, and had more left to give. So many good players the Habs have parted with.
    Bergevin can't sit still. He has a giant ego, and thinks it's all about him. I'm getting sick of him saying "it's on me". No kidding.

    At least the Habs got a great player with Weber (who scored two tonight).

    Unlike, say, Andrighetto for Martinson. Or losing Radulov for nothing. Gave up Beaulieu for next to nothing. Loses Emelin to Vegas, not the greatest D, but hits like a truck. Loses Markov, just one of the most solid D in the league, with maybe the best outlet pass, and says he'll replace him with Mark Streit (gone) and Schlemko (budget D - injured).

    So, counting Sergachev, that's 4 left D - gone. Replaced by Jordie Benn, who is a solid ok. And Karl Alzner, who's actually looking good, but not great. Lucky that Mete is really looking good, and might stick past 9 games.

    Steve Ott - bust. Martinson - bust. Dwight King - bust. Ales HemsKy??? - bust. All utterly predictable.
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    Matt Duchene finally traded
    https://twitter.com/FriedgeHNIC/stat...28405107777536

    Duchene to OTT. Turris to NASH with a 6x6 extension. COL gets Girard, Kamenev, Bowers, Hammond, a 1st (OTT), a 2nd (NASH) and a 3rd (OTT).
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    That is an incredible haul for Sakic to get for a player who so desperately and publicly wanted to be moved. Sure shines a light on the return that Chiarelli was able to get for Eberle this past summer.

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    ^Centers are worth a lot more than wings. We have been spoiled last few years, it wasn't that long ago we couldn't find a second line center let alone a first.
    Last edited by moahunter; 06-11-2017 at 07:54 AM.

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    Eberle trade was a salary dump to sign McDavid and Drai so there was a tad more desperation there since his value was dropping like a rock.
    As for the return to Colorado, it remains to be seen if those prospects and picks pan out. Hamburgler's game dried up quickly, so that part of the bargain wasn't that good for Sakic.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SDM
    Eberle trade was a salary dump to sign McDavid and Drai so there was a tad more desperation there since his value was dropping like a rock.


    Again, they basically swapped Eberle for Russell/Strome cap-wise. And that is a terrible swap. It's becoming pretty obvious how much Sekera was carrying Russell last year, and Nurse was to start the year. Put Russell with Gryba, and they get pummeled because neither guy can move the puck worth a crap. So cap-wise, that's a terrible swap. And most importantly, there was no need to clear salary this season because McDavid's extension doesn't kick in till next.

    As far as the Eberle/Strome trade itself goes, look at what Sakic was able to get for Duchene, who was disgruntled and asked for a trade which typically makes it more difficult to get a good return. Eberle wanted to stay, at least publicly. Compare their career numbers. They're almost identical, and Eberle actually has the edge in terms of PPG. I agree that Eberle likely had to go after his brutal playoff performance last year, but Chiarelli traded him for magic beans basically. Duchene and Eberle's contracts are also identical in terms of salary and term.

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    Duchene is a much better player than Eberle. Stats don't really tell the story with him. Matt Duchene was going through the motions last year because he knew he was gone from Colorado.

    Take each of those players and compare them when they are really going and it's no contest.

    Sakic did the best he could, but there were quite a few teams salivating at getting Duchene, and none really big on Eberle.
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    While I agree Duchene is the better player, and a better driver of offence because he anticipates better and creates plays, the discrepancy and results and performance doesn't warrant the degree of disparity in trade value obtained.

    Every Oiler fan is noting the Duchene trade right now, and for good reason.

    Chia just isn't any good at trades. he always gives more than he gets for profile players.



    The argument that the Oilers required cap dump this season, made by another poster, is just **** poor.
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    ^so what other offer Eberle do you think PC turned down when he shopped him? I think PC took what he could get, which wasn't much at his price tag of 6m. Duchene by contrast has a lot of appeal to a lot of teams.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    Duchene is a much better player than Eberle. Stats don't really tell the story with him. Matt Duchene was going through the motions last year because he knew he was gone from Colorado.

    Take each of those players and compare them when they are really going and it's no contest.

    Sakic did the best he could, but there were quite a few teams salivating at getting Duchene, and none really big on Eberle.

    If teams weren't salivating over Eberle, Chiarelli should have just kept him. That is the whole point. I'm sure Sakic turned down a lot of brutal offers while he waited for one that was acceptable.
    The Oilers did not need the cap space this year, so there should have been zero desperation to get rid of him coming off what was perceived as a down year. Meanwhile, on the same day Eberle had 2 goals (and Matt Barzal had 5 assists) for NYI, I watched Connor McDavid take shifts on a line in between Jussi Jokinen and Drake Cagguila. Chiarelli has bungled this roster beyond belief.

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    To be clear, I think Duchene is the better player, but it's not a huge gap. The disparity in return on the two trades is absolutely massive. And Chiarelli seemingly had no plan for replacing that lost offence.

  72. #3072

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    To be clear, I think Duchene is the better player, but it's not a huge gap. The disparity in return on the two trades is absolutely massive. And Chiarelli seemingly had no plan for replacing that lost offence.
    To add insult this season Lucic has two goals/six pts and Hall is knocking out of the ballpark tied for topten in league scoring, 17pts. Even Eberle with 11pts. .
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    To be clear, I think Duchene is the better player, but it's not a huge gap. The disparity in return on the two trades is absolutely massive. And Chiarelli seemingly had no plan for replacing that lost offence.
    To add insult this season Lucic has two goals/six pts and Hall is knocking out of the ballpark tied for topten in league scoring, 17pts. Even Eberle with 11pts. .
    And just to be clear what did this team win with Hall and Eberle - I think it was yearly draft lotteries and the best overall finish 26 th???????

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    Quote Originally Posted by ridgeman View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    To be clear, I think Duchene is the better player, but it's not a huge gap. The disparity in return on the two trades is absolutely massive. And Chiarelli seemingly had no plan for replacing that lost offence.
    To add insult this season Lucic has two goals/six pts and Hall is knocking out of the ballpark tied for topten in league scoring, 17pts. Even Eberle with 11pts. .
    And just to be clear what did this team win with Hall and Eberle - I think it was yearly draft lotteries and the best overall finish 26 th???????
    The team traded Hall after half a season of McDavid and before Leon had totally developed. There was no reason not to wait a season to see what we had. That would have been the responsible thing for a new GM to do.

    Imagine a club with 3 highly talented offensive drivers like this. Chia now set the table for that zenith never being realized.

    You can get top 4 D as Calgary proves time and again. What you can't get is players that can go ppg. That's an extremely rare breed. Even eberle had a 74 pt season and we next to gave him away.

    Where is the team now? 14th place and zero scoring depth and no help on the horizon, Chia traded all the chips.
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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    ^so what other offer Eberle do you think PC turned down when he shopped him? I think PC took what he could get, which wasn't much at his price tag of 6m. Duchene by contrast has a lot of appeal to a lot of teams.
    How many consistent 20 goal scorers are there in the NHL? Not many. PC rushed to deal Eberle far too quickly, there was no need to rush, Sakic and Yzerman have proven that. PC could and should have gotten much more for Hall and Eberle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KevinW View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    Duchene is a much better player than Eberle. Stats don't really tell the story with him. Matt Duchene was going through the motions last year because he knew he was gone from Colorado.

    Take each of those players and compare them when they are really going and it's no contest.

    Sakic did the best he could, but there were quite a few teams salivating at getting Duchene, and none really big on Eberle.

    If teams weren't salivating over Eberle, Chiarelli should have just kept him. That is the whole point. I'm sure Sakic turned down a lot of brutal offers while he waited for one that was acceptable.
    The Oilers did not need the cap space this year, so there should have been zero desperation to get rid of him coming off what was perceived as a down year. Meanwhile, on the same day Eberle had 2 goals (and Matt Barzal had 5 assists) for NYI, I watched Connor McDavid take shifts on a line in between Jussi Jokinen and Drake Cagguila. Chiarelli has bungled this roster beyond belief.
    I agree. I would have kept Eberle until I got more for him. I think he's a very good player. But here in Edmonton there's a tendency to single out one player for derision. Being good isn't enough - there's always the spector (no pun intended) of the glory years Oilers, and every player gets held to a ridiculous standard. It reminded me of the Jason Arnott situation - the water was so poisoned they had to move him. The situation was untenable.

    This is also the city that decided Paul Coffey had to go, for similar reasons. He only went on to win a Cup, and get named to the Hall of Fame.

    But the situation with Duchene was untenable too. Sakic shut out all those calling him an ***** who was making unrealistic demands.

    They did waste an entire season figuring this out. Another disaster season in Edmonton wasn't acceptable after the decade of ditching.

    It remains to be seen how well Colorado makes out. The best thing would have been to keep him, but that wasn't an option for awhile. He's the best player in the trade, and is full value for his contract.

    I think Chiarelli was hoping to be right in the thick of it at trade deadline time, and wanted to use the cap space to pick up a rental ringer or two to put the team over the top.
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    Eberle had to go. I remember watching him in the playoffs and thinking this constantly. He just wasn't giving a ***** and gave the puck away constantly. Passing the puck to opponents leading directly to goals was just the last straw. Do you not remember? I was so happy when they traded him, no matter what the consequences. I had been telling friends they could trade him and his $6m contract for a bag of pucks and everyone seemed to agree. It wasn't just the playoffs I had been feeling that way for a while and the playoffs just clinched it for me. Hall skated and skated but always lost or gave away the puck too. Frustrating as hell. I dont miss either of them. I know most people agree. The Oilers played well against NJ. This is how they can play. They have the team they just can not do it consistently. Is it time to look at the coaching again? I like Todd but sometimes change is a fresh start. Keep McLellan upstairs but try someone else down there just to see what happens. Maybe a fresh team behind the bench would spark the team on the ice. Then again, I could be completely wrong. Just a thought.
    Last edited by Drumbones; 07-11-2017 at 02:30 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones
    Is it time to look at the coaching again? I like Todd but sometimes change is a fresh start. Keep McLellan upstairs but try someone else down there just to see what happens. Maybe a fresh team behind the bench would spark the team on the ice. Then again, I could be completely wrong. Just a thought.


    You're completely wrong. He's only just starting his third season with the team. Successful NHL teams don't change coaches every 2-3 years. The organization just barely crawled back to respectability in the last year or two in terms of how it was run behind the scenes. Firing McLellan now would undo a lot of that. If you were an experienced, successful coach would you want to come work for an organization that constantly fires coaches because they can't perform miracles?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones
    Is it time to look at the coaching again? I like Todd but sometimes change is a fresh start. Keep McLellan upstairs but try someone else down there just to see what happens. Maybe a fresh team behind the bench would spark the team on the ice. Then again, I could be completely wrong. Just a thought.


    You're completely wrong. He's only just starting his third season with the team. Successful NHL teams don't change coaches every 2-3 years. The organization just barely crawled back to respectability in the last year or two in terms of how it was run behind the scenes. Firing McLellan now would undo a lot of that. If you were an experienced, successful coach would you want to come work for an organization that constantly fires coaches because they can't perform miracles?
    Completely agree. 13 games after leading the Oilers out of the Decade of Darkness and to Round 2 game 7, and suddenly everyone wants to throw the coach under the bus already. One thing I've learned about a lot of Oilers fans, is they are quick to the knee jerk reactions when things are not going well. The team is largely in tact except for a couple of side pieces (Pouliot, Eberle), and the go to people from last season haven't been consistent enough this year. Old, bad habits have crept back into some of their games this season.

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    I think it was just me, no one else, sorry. I do like McLellan myself too. Just trying to figure out the mystery I guess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    I think it was just me, no one else, sorry. I do like McLellan myself too. Just trying to figure out the mystery I guess.
    Not just you, from what I've been hearing.

    Lots of Oilers fans are really having a hard time trying to figure it out.

    Maybe the Oilers should have a shooting drill in practice where players stand 3 feet in front of the goal and practice shooting pucks into an empty net. If they'd bury even a few of those glorious opportunities we'd be having a different conversation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones
    Is it time to look at the coaching again? I like Todd but sometimes change is a fresh start. Keep McLellan upstairs but try someone else down there just to see what happens. Maybe a fresh team behind the bench would spark the team on the ice. Then again, I could be completely wrong. Just a thought.


    You're completely wrong. He's only just starting his third season with the team. Successful NHL teams don't change coaches every 2-3 years. The organization just barely crawled back to respectability in the last year or two in terms of how it was run behind the scenes. Firing McLellan now would undo a lot of that. If you were an experienced, successful coach would you want to come work for an organization that constantly fires coaches because they can't perform miracles?
    Before TM Oilers were becoming that kind of team, releasing coaches so frequently, Krueger, Eakins etc just to name a few. I recall how this really bothered Taylor Hall with all the coaches that the Oilers were letting go here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Meanwhile another media darling, the Winnipeg Jets, who always seem to be pumped by TSN are again pathetic and have been blown out in both of their games this season allowing 13GA in 2GP thus far. The Jets are absolutely hopeless. How anybody could pick this club to make the playoffs I have no idea. They were up 3-1 against the Flames and lost going away, 6-3. Teams should start spotting the Jets a two goal lead.


    What's your take on the Jets these days?


    (For the record, I'm an Oilers fan first, but given Winnipeg's rollercoaster hockey history - losing its team, and then miracously getting one back - I'm happy to see them do well, and I will gladly cheer for them whenever they're not playing the Oilers.
    )
    Last edited by OJR; 19-11-2017 at 04:03 PM.

  84. #3084

    Default Hall backs up Eberle on “bad” Edmonton media

    Poor babies, how dare the media call out sports people earning 6m a year for not really earning it?

    https://oilersnation.com/2017/11/27/...dmonton-media/

    That would be like criticizing a bad acting performance, or a political error or bad cooking at a restaurant or ... the horror.

    Glad they are both gone, they clearly belong in non Canadian markets where nobody cares about the team.
    Last edited by moahunter; 27-11-2017 at 05:58 PM.

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    Yeah, can't say that either of their recent comments has improved my impression of their character.

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    They showed a clip of him during intermission. That was a pretty egregious move slamming his stick against the glass like that. Lets see how the Flames respond to that this evening.
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    Speaking of the Godless Flames, sounds like Jagr's contract is about to be terminated.
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    That's a shame for him to go out a Flame. I guess you could say Jagr "flamed out."
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

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    Maybe PC will sign him
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    Right now Connor is passing to everyone but no one can score. Sounds like a crazy idea but we know he can score, especially in close to the net.

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    Winnipeg and Vegas battling for top spot in the West. I wonder how many people would have predicted THAT at the beginning of the season?

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    Quote Originally Posted by OJR View Post
    Winnipeg and Vegas battling for top spot in the West. I wonder how many people would have predicted THAT at the beginning of the season?
    Winnipeg maybe, but Vegas - nobody. I think almost everyone had them last.

    Quite a story.

    Colorado and New Jersey ar surprises too.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OJR View Post
    Winnipeg and Vegas battling for top spot in the West. I wonder how many people would have predicted THAT at the beginning of the season?
    probably not many, although it's a bit like the sign at the shoemakers - you can have it quickly/you can have it cheaply/you can have it with quality, please pick any two.

    in the hockey world, i think that translates (albeit not directly) to three different things as well - work ethic, confidence and talent. while it's nice to have all three, any two - but not less than two - are what's needed to be successful. winnipeg and vegas have the first two and some of the third. edmonton - other than the last half of last year - have had lots of the third for much of the last decade but not enough of the first two.

    as with management - it probably comes from management - you can say the right things until you're blue in the face but at some point you have to walk the walk (unless you're lucky enough to have a boys on the bus pass). it doesn't matter how much talent there is if you can't bring at least one of the other two on the ice to go along with it each and every game all game long.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    ...

    Canucks look like speed bumps again this season.
    Especially missing 2/3 of their top line.

    But, somehow, a point behind the Oilers, who they play tonight, with a game in hand.
    aka Jim Good; "The sooner you fall behind, the more time you have to catch up." - Steven Wright

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Postmedia sports writers have to be about the worst. Completely clueless. 5/9 polled recently picked the Dallas Stars to make the SC final and advance out of the West. Dallas missed the playoffs last year and can't play D to save their lives. Dallas, imo predictably, loses their first 2 games including to the Expansion Las Vegas Golden nights and are already 0-2. Giving up countless scoring chances.

    Meanwhile the same wags have Tampa, who also missed the playoffs advancing in the East and winning the cup. Most of them are apparently huge tampa fans. Tampa also missed the playoffs last year.

    Yeah I know Stamkos is back. But Drouin, one of the best players for the Lightning last season, is gone.

    Meanwhile another media darling, the Winnipeg Jets, who always seem to be pumped by TSN are again pathetic and have been blown out in both of their games this season allowing 13GA in 2GP thus far. The Jets are absolutely hopeless. How anybody could pick this club to make the playoffs I have no idea. They were up 3-1 against the Flames and lost going away, 6-3. Teams should start spotting the Jets a two goal lead.
    Jets won again tonight to remain in first place in the Central Division, 4 points back of league leading Tampa. After a bad start Dallas are really coming on.

    The rookie defenceman Tampa traded Drouin for has two more goals and two more assists than Drouin in limited ice time.

    Not to be an "I-told-you-so". I'm just normally not the type to point it out when people get it so wrong
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    If The Oilers dont get into the playoffs A.B.C so i'm putting my support this playoff year for the Jets.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Postmedia sports writers have to be about the worst. Completely clueless. 5/9 polled recently picked the Dallas Stars to make the SC final and advance out of the West. Dallas missed the playoffs last year and can't play D to save their lives. Dallas, imo predictably, loses their first 2 games including to the Expansion Las Vegas Golden nights and are already 0-2. Giving up countless scoring chances.

    Meanwhile the same wags have Tampa, who also missed the playoffs advancing in the East and winning the cup. Most of them are apparently huge tampa fans. Tampa also missed the playoffs last year.

    Yeah I know Stamkos is back. But Drouin, one of the best players for the Lightning last season, is gone.

    Meanwhile another media darling, the Winnipeg Jets, who always seem to be pumped by TSN are again pathetic and have been blown out in both of their games this season allowing 13GA in 2GP thus far. The Jets are absolutely hopeless. How anybody could pick this club to make the playoffs I have no idea. They were up 3-1 against the Flames and lost going away, 6-3. Teams should start spotting the Jets a two goal lead.
    Jets won again tonight to remain in first place in the Central Division, 4 points back of league leading Tampa. After a bad start Dallas are really coming on.

    The rookie defenceman Tampa traded Drouin for has two more goals and two more assists than Drouin in limited ice time.

    Not to be an "I-told-you-so". I'm just normally not the type to point it out when people get it so wrong
    haha. For sure wrong on the Jets. I just don't have a bead on that team. With some teams you get whats clicking and with others you don't get it. I don't watch the Jets enough to appreciate what they do well. I'll cede that. Drouin? Kid had the makings of a star. I honestly think he's been screwed over, happens with enough players still, and its so odd how some players are just immediately granted opportunities to succeed and with others its "work for it, work for it". Seems like coaches and GM's often have double standards. In fairness to Drouin the Montreal situation is a mess. Everybody by now knowing the Subban for Weber trade was a disaster and primarily due to where the players were at in respective careers. With Subban getting better, Weber getting worse. So that Drouin landed in a very bad spot there. The whole club including Price have been in a funk.
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    Oilers this year are long shots. If they can get a good 9 game winning streak, then they are in the playoffs, more or less. I'm just supporting a Canadian team ABC because the Jets are legit. Denver is in its 9 game streak and in December at one point they were abt where the Oilers are now. Something clicked on that Denver team..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement
    So that Drouin landed in a very bad spot there.


    I feel bad for Drouin. He's a decent player, but he wasn't what the Canadiens needed, in that he's not the right player to be a first or even second line center. He's a talented scoring winger. But Sergachev is going to be one of the best D in the league for the next 15 years. It was an absolutely horrendous trade on Bergevin's part. And like it or not, Drouin will always be reminded of who he got traded for.

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